I personally am a vegetarian. I would like to know everyones feelings on the matter.I have grown up carnivorous and my whole family (aside from myself) is carnivorous. I have discussed with my friend (who is not vegetarian) many times why being vegetarian is better then being carnivorous.
Finally we came to an agreement. We think that Animals should have respect and not be hunted for sport. That people should (but don't have to) thank the meat before it is eaten. So what does everyone think?

I think that vegetarians are crazy. Humans were meant to eat meat. Hunting is much more than actually killing an animal. It has to do with bonding. Sitting in a deer stand with your friends and relatives is great. I am omnivorous, meaning that I eat both meat and plants. Humans are currently at the top of the food chain. It means that we are supposed to eat the things under us.

You can bond other ways then killing defenseless animals. I believe that animals should not be hunted for the sport of killing them. I believe they should have the rights to sanctity of life. If they are killed I think it should be in a humane way and be thanked for giving there bodies so we can live. I also think factory farms are disgusting. We may be at the top of the food chain, but babies are below us on the food chain so should we kill them too?

You are incorrect. Animals aren't exactly defenseless. My cousin, a rancher, will never walk again because he was trampled by a cow. Animals that are eaten are killed in humane ways. Many of them don't even know that they are hurt. They just die. What is a cow going to do if you thank it? Tell you that your welcome and that it's glad you are eating it?

The fact is that there are predators and there are prey. We are the top predator, and babies are our children. (Baby eating actually didn't happen as much a propaganda might lead you to believe) Mammals, in most cases, protect their offspring, not eat it. That's why we don't eat babies, and that's why we are evolutionarily advanced from other organisms.

Factory farms provide jobs, and meat for a low cost. Chances that whatever you eat comes from a factory farm. Do you eat corn? Nearly all corn is genetically modified so that other things don't eat it. Unless you shop an an organic store, all your fruits and vegetables have pesticides on them. Anything that has pesticides comes from a factory farm. It's called Industrial Agriculture, look it up, it's part of factory farming. Ranches are an important industry for America. Without ranches, we would be like India where cows run freely. This is not only dangerous, it is unsanitary.

Cows aren't gods. It's illogical. When was the last time you thanked someone who served in the armed forces? They put their life on the line for your country and I bet that you have never thanked them? Are cows more important than people?

I'm not a vegetarian but there are types of meat that I refuse to eat, like lamb. I find it hard to eat lamb without actually thinking about sheep, i know that sounds weird, but i have an emotional blcok as far as eating lamb goes. I think sometimes that with the mass production of meat and factory farms and stuff people don't really think about what they're eating or what it really is and so people kinda lose that whole hunting experience.

I don't disagree with hunting, though I doubt I could kill an animal, I have trouble killing bugs. I think hunting an animal is more moral than the factory farms. Humans have been hunting since the beginning of time, it's the way things work.

People have different views on things, if someone wants to be a vegetarian, let them. If someone wants to hunt, let them. There's nothing wrong with either choice, neither should be ridiculed

Firstly, I do show at organic stores and co-ops. Secondly, We grow very much of our own food. I do not think that animals or vegetables for that matter should have artificial growth hormones. I think it is disgusting. In factory farms they do not treat the animals with respect. Many of the farms won't even let the animals turn around or see sunlight. Watch the Meatrix maybe you will learn a thing or two.

Animals aren't completely defenseless but they are more defenseless then us. They should be thanked. What about their soul? Would you want to be killed and eaten? I think not. Animals have feelings too!

I know that mammals don't eat their young, but you said that we are the top of the food chain so we SHOULD eat what is below us. Does that mean we should kill babies and eat them? To your logic we should. Don't get me wrong. I don't think we should eat our babies, but they are below us on the food chain. You said what is below us on the food chain should be eaten by things above them. Would you eat your dog or cat? Would you eat a baby lion?(Please don't bring up the 'if need be yes I would' argument. I have herd it way to much before). We can do all of this, but it doesn't mean we SHOULD!!

I do not think cows are gods. I also don't think humans are gods. I do thank people in the army for protecting our country. Even though I do not support them killing other people. I think it is respectful of us to give animals respect.

I am not saying that everyone of the word should be vegetarian. I know that is an impossible thought, but animals should be treated the way you would want them to treat you. Why shouldn't the golden rule apply to all? and not just humans.

Actually, it has been proven that animals, dogs at least, don't have "souls". Humans weighed before and after death, without any fluids being pumped from them, have showed significant weight loss. When the same test was performed on dogs, they didn't lose any weight. If something comes along that is more evolutionarily advanced than me and can catch and eat me, so be it. It's the circle of life.

No, you didn't read that correctly. Mammals protect their young and rarely eat them. That's what my logics says plain and simple. We don't eat babies because they are our offspring, and therefore atop the food chain with us.

Many cultures do eat dogs and cats. That's fine with me. They can eat what they want. The only circumstances where it would be considered "okay" with our culture is if you were in an emergency situation. How many baby lions are available to eat here in America? When I go to Ghana this summer, if I'm offered, I would eat lion.

Animals can't understand us thanking them. They don't thank the food that they eat for being a meal for them.

Our brains tell us that it's wrong to eat things that are evolutionarily close to us. That's why most people wouldn't eat a monkey. If you feel evolutionarily close to a cow, or a chicken, that's your right. It just doesn't make sense to me. Animals don't have feelings that we can understand. They can't speak and tell us that they feel sad.

The golden rule shouldn't apply to anyone. You have to look out for number one, that's you, then worry about everyone else. It sounds selfish, but If you are happy, isn't someone sad? If you get a job, aren't there at least a few who didn't get the job? If you have something to eat, there will always be someone who is hungry. If you can make a whole bunch of people happy, but there will always be at least a few that aren't happy with the decision.

Animals don't have feelings that WE understand. It doesn't mean they don't have them. you do not know for sure whether they understand. For all you know we could be the ones not understanding them! And a soul does not weigh anything. Its a soul!! you can't see if they have a soul. Everything and everyone has a soul, even a rock or a tree.

I know that cultures do eat dogs and cats, but would you eat YOUR dog or cat? A pet that you have befriended, not just a wild one.

Also you don't know for sure that animals don't that the food they eat. You don't know if they have souls or not.

The golden rule should apply to everyone. You shouldn't kill something because you can. You should treat everyone equal. Have respect for humans and animals alike.

You can say that everyone and everything is equal. You can say that you aren't racist and that you don't have your own racial bias. You can pretend that the sexes are equal. The truth is that all of the ism's of the world can't be abolished unless everyone looked exactly the same, was hermaphroditic, and if everyone had the same brain. It doesn't work.

I can't tell what animal are thinking because they aren't intelligent enough to tell me.

I offered you scientific evidence that humans have souls and that animals, dogs at least, don't.

People don't kill just because they can. There is such a thing as sportsmanship. If you haven't been hunting, you can't understand.

The golden rule doesn't exist nowadays. The capitalistic society we live in doesn't allow for it. I guarantee that you don't live by the golden rule, at least not all the time. You are cutting down my ideas, and I bet you don't like it when I cut down your's. I acknowledge that I don't follow it. I can't, and I bet if you take a close look at your life, you can't either. In an ideal world it would apply to everyone, not everything.

Communication between the species has been proven not to exist, with a few exceptions, which include dogs understanding 400 words, and monkeys understanding sign language. we can't understand what a cow is saying, nor can they understand what we are saying. That means that it is a waste of time to say thanks.

Animals aren't people. They don't deserve the same level of respect.

Fin - I totally agree with you on this one.

Simner, you seem to justify your argument with the Sanctity of Life, a christian perspective. If you were a true Christian you would agree that we, as humans are apart from animals. We have souls. This is mentioned in Genisis : "We shall make man in our own image, to rule over animals, fish and birds etc..." The Sanctity of Life is only relevant in humans if you agree with Christian ethics.

Animals cannot love. They do not respond to care, love etc... They respond to instinct. There is no disagreement here, a dog that you have had for 10 years would abandon you for a piece of meat if met with the choice. However most dont because their INSTINCTS tell them that with you there is more food, a large supply. They do as they are told for treats, food and sometimes out of fear. All primordial instincts. They do not love as we do, they can only have sex and reproduce. Animals do not love. Therefore, we eat them, they are not conscious beings.

Nature intended for human beings to eat meat. In fact if we did not eat meat we would be little more than a straight backed chimp. Homo Sapiens are omnivorous beings, we should have a balance of meats and plants (veg). Vegetarianism doesnt make sense because it goes against nature's principal.

And then is your classic "how would you like to be eaten" - the answer is simple - we don't know! We dont know because were are at the top of the food chain, chances are we wont get eaten because we are the most intelligent and strongest beings on the planet. We are the ONLY conscious beings.

I don't think my dog would abondon me for a piece of meat...a tennis ball maybe...but I don't know. lol

I agree with adam...the point of animals is for us to eat. I know times have changed since then....but it's still the case, really. I don't eat McDonalds though, because their chicens are genetically mutated so they have "unusually large breasts" which made me lmfao but seriously....they mature in 2 weeks and their legs don't really work, and they're in constant pain, and they eat the other chichen left over meat that they don't use in thie chicken at McDonalds and stuff. So I don't eat there. And because you're practically eating death on a bun, but that's beside the point. lol. My grandpa (before he had to go to a nursing home) would always go out and hunt and bring home food and stuff. I don't really have a problem with it. It's how it is.

And I dunno if this is stretching it or not, but if you're going on the whole christian morals thing like adam said....then no, shouldn't thank a piece of meat. Isn't that bearing a false idol? If you're christian, you should thank god for that, for providing the meat for you and all that.

But, I'd rather die than kill my cats or my dog. Anyone that knows me or has been to my house knows that.

Actually Kiley, congrats btw, the only way to make sure that something doesn't have hormones in it, is to raise it yourself. Most any meat or vegetable you can buy at the store has had hormones or pesticides to make it grow faster and bigger.

Oh my a religious debate. That's another can of worms that I don't want to open here...

Why did I get a congrats? I like getting congrats...lol

yeah, that's true I guess. My friend did a report on McDonalds, and that's only part of the reason I don't want to eat there anymore. Because I did feel bad for the chickens with their unusually large breasts. lmao. that's exactly how he said it and it made me laugh so hard it's not even cool. And that they made them eat other dead chickens...urgh. In the conclusion of his speach, my friend was like "so don't forget about the genetically mutated canibal chickens next time you bite into that jucy fattening big mac. yum." lol

anyway, that's not the point....

and if everything has a soul, should you thank your bread too? the wheat had to die and be cut down.

and if a tree has a soul, writing on paper wouldn't be moral, would it?

(sorry if this is coming off as bitchy or mean or something, sim. I don't mean it like that...)

everything has to die. It's how life is. If we didn't kill animals to eat then they would over populate the earth and it's be an all around bad thing. I'm not saying like "GO KILL POLAR BEARS BECAUSE IF NOT THEY'LL OVER POPULATE THE PLANET AND RULE THE WORLD" but....I don't think people shouldn't eat meat. Our bodies are designed to eat meat. We have certain teeth for meat and our digestive system handles it too...if we were ment to be vegitarians, we'd have different bodies.

With your acting. I'm happy when people I know are successful.

I agree Kiley. There has to be a line somewhere. I choose to draw it before thanking the animal that I'm eating.

First, and foremost I am not Christian. If anything I am pagan. I do thank the food I eat. Even veggies, I do at every meal. So please don't tell me what I am and am not doing.

I think animals have the same right to live just as humans do. They should be treated as humans. I believe that animals do have souls and can love. Humans can live without meat. I know many people who do and have sense birth. I am not saying its a bad thing to eat meat. I am saying they you should be respectful of the animals and there souls.

I understand that we are at the top of the food chain and should therefor eat what is below us, but remember the native Americans? They used every bit of the animal they could and thanked the animals soul. Because they believed in reincarnation and they equality of animals, plants and humans.

To me, this is looking more like a religious thing than anything. Christians and Pagans have different beliefs. Since Paganism is an earth-based religion, they're more in tune with the elements and nature. So it's not exactly weird to them to thank whatever they take from the earth. But..I don't really know anything about the christian side of this.
Personally, I think you all have pretty good points. But I agree with Adam more and everything.

Thanks Finn.
I think you're happier about it than most of my friends. Just thought I'd throw that out there...lol

Yeah, I had a feeling you'd say you were more of a pagan. I think that's a really interesting religion.

Yeah, I guess it all depends on what you believe in. I'm christian, so I wouldn't thank my food, because by what I believe, that'd be wrong. I have a friend that's a vegitarian, and she doesn't thank her food or whatever.

I do, think that scientifically, it's not natural for humans to not eat meat. I think our bodies were designed for meat and greens and stuff. We need the protein and stuff from meat. I know that in today's world you can take vitamin suppliments, but sill. I think there's nothing wrong with it, but I think that we were designed to eat meat.

Personally I do eat meat, because humans are omnivores etc. etc. but I don't beleive that the animals should suffer before they die, in my mind it's just needless cruelty.


I don't support hunting, for instance fox hunting, where the fox is usually shot and wounded, then torn apart by the pack of dogs, because it serves no purpose, you can't eat the fox or use it's fur because it's been torn apart, it's just killing for the sake of killing (I know some farmers say they kill foxes because they hunt thier chickens, but the royal family and aristocrats don't own farms or chickens to protect, they hunt for fun).

yeah, I agree with that. It's un necessary suffering. And it's inhumane.

The sanctity of life is a christian idea, however I can see that you may believe something similar.

Simner - Animals cannot love as we do. They mate for reproduction, they do not have feelings for their mate. Next year - they do it all over again with different mates. There is no love there, because it is a higher intelligence thing.

Satoru - The cruelest thing in the history of Great Britain was banning foxhunting. All those fox hounds were terminated en mass because they had no purpose when fox hunting went. I an very pro-fox hunting, mainly because contrary to believe it IS humane. The fox dies almost instantly, the tearing apart seems brutal but its just tearing apart dead meat. It is more INhumane to keep chickens in tiny cages, or feed cattle on pellets made from sheep spine.

Humans were meant to need the protein meat gives, but you can get protein other ways like nuts and things. Many people think there is no other way to get protein besides meat... which is not true. Vegetarian and Vegan people have lived for a very long time without any side affects

I do not support fox hunting at all. It has no reason except to kill something just so you can kill it and hang it on a wall. I am fully agenist hunting for sport. Or other types of hunting. Instead of using its meat you don't use anything of it. Very few people actually use the skins at all. They might put it over a chair or something... but that Fox had a family and tribe.

Adam, you do not know animals can't love. You can run as many tests as you want, but you aren't a animal. you don't know what it feels like to be an animal and you never will (Unless you are reincarnated as one). I can say that I had two dogs. One died a few years back and the other one has been depressed sense. It knew what happened. It did feel sad. There is no way around it.

And no... one dog was male the other was female and they never had puppies or anything.

if the foxhounds hadn't been bred specially for hunting in the first place there'd be no need to terminate them.

It's the same with certain breeds of dogs that keep getting in the news for savaging toddlers, it's because that breed has been bred for hunting and then they get an owner that doesn't know how to control them properly.

Satoru, we could go on and on and go further and further back but thing is: if hunting was never started, there wouldnt be any dogs. Terriers, hounds, danes and many other breeds of dogs were all bred for a game sport.